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	<title>
	Comments on: BREAKING: Supreme Court Overrules Chevron Deference, Dealing a Body Blow to ATF Regulatory Power	</title>
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		<title>
		By: SAFEupstateFML		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4805</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SAFEupstateFML]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Jun 2024 17:05:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4805</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4789&quot;&gt;LKB&lt;/a&gt;.

Not going to lie I did consider that one but unfortunately the belt fed part is probably a killer even in manual action for NY SAFE act re capacity (even with cut 10 round belts). Would be an interesting legal fight but a bit beyond my budget.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4789">LKB</a>.</p>
<p>Not going to lie I did consider that one but unfortunately the belt fed part is probably a killer even in manual action for NY SAFE act re capacity (even with cut 10 round belts). Would be an interesting legal fight but a bit beyond my budget.</p>
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		<title>
		By: LKB		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4789</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[LKB]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Jun 2024 13:36:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4789</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4725&quot;&gt;SAFEupstateFML&lt;/a&gt;.

Well, if you have a spare $5k to burn, there’s always this:

https://tippmannordnance.com/22lr-gatling-gun/

It’s not even covered by the NFA (unless you attach a motor to the crank and turn it into a Poor Man’s Illegal Minigun).]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4725">SAFEupstateFML</a>.</p>
<p>Well, if you have a spare $5k to burn, there’s always this:</p>
<p><a href="https://tippmannordnance.com/22lr-gatling-gun/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://tippmannordnance.com/22lr-gatling-gun/</a></p>
<p>It’s not even covered by the NFA (unless you attach a motor to the crank and turn it into a Poor Man’s Illegal Minigun).</p>
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		<title>
		By: SAFEupstateFML		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4725</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SAFEupstateFML]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Jun 2024 02:13:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4725</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Really any belt fed system and more than a few large frame pistols but agree the 22 would be a lot of silly fun.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really any belt fed system and more than a few large frame pistols but agree the 22 would be a lot of silly fun.</p>
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		<title>
		By: LKB		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4715</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[LKB]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jun 2024 22:04:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4715</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4683&quot;&gt;SAFEupstateFML&lt;/a&gt;.

Hmmmmm.   Yeah, I guess I can imagine an open bolt, belt-fed, AR upper that would be a lot simpler than a closed bolt belt fed system.   

Or for that matter, a belt-fed blowback .22 LR that fires from an open bolt.  Now *that* could be fun.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4683">SAFEupstateFML</a>.</p>
<p>Hmmmmm.   Yeah, I guess I can imagine an open bolt, belt-fed, AR upper that would be a lot simpler than a closed bolt belt fed system.   </p>
<p>Or for that matter, a belt-fed blowback .22 LR that fires from an open bolt.  Now *that* could be fun.</p>
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		<title>
		By: SAFEupstateFML		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4683</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SAFEupstateFML]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jun 2024 17:19:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4683</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4672&quot;&gt;LKB&lt;/a&gt;.

Possibly not but every improvement to issued gear I saw for the better part of a decade came from the private sector and often individual tinkerers so having the option open could only help with addressing some of the feed issues I found with the M249 and I am sure there are cheaper ways to do some things with open bolt.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4672">LKB</a>.</p>
<p>Possibly not but every improvement to issued gear I saw for the better part of a decade came from the private sector and often individual tinkerers so having the option open could only help with addressing some of the feed issues I found with the M249 and I am sure there are cheaper ways to do some things with open bolt.</p>
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		<title>
		By: LKB		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4672</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[LKB]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jun 2024 14:27:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4672</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4611&quot;&gt;Dmitar&lt;/a&gt;.

Interesting question.   Since 1982, ATF has treated open-bolt semis as MGs (and thus effectively banning them, although they grandfathered in existing ones), based on ATF’s determination that open-bolt semis can be “readily converted” to MG’s.   Nobody ever bothered to challenge this, as such would have been exactly the kind of determination that would have been given Chevron deference.

No longer.   Now, if challenged, ATF would have to *actually* show that particular open bolt semis are more “readily convertible” to MG’s than other semis.  While this may be the case for some (apparently, it *was* very easy to convert an open-bolt Uzi or MAC-10 semi to FA), I can envision a manufacturer designing an open-bolt semi with features that make it difficult to convert to FA, and thus challenge the ATF’s ruling as improper as applied.  

(Why anyone would actually WANT an open-bolt semi is another question.)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4611">Dmitar</a>.</p>
<p>Interesting question.   Since 1982, ATF has treated open-bolt semis as MGs (and thus effectively banning them, although they grandfathered in existing ones), based on ATF’s determination that open-bolt semis can be “readily converted” to MG’s.   Nobody ever bothered to challenge this, as such would have been exactly the kind of determination that would have been given Chevron deference.</p>
<p>No longer.   Now, if challenged, ATF would have to *actually* show that particular open bolt semis are more “readily convertible” to MG’s than other semis.  While this may be the case for some (apparently, it *was* very easy to convert an open-bolt Uzi or MAC-10 semi to FA), I can envision a manufacturer designing an open-bolt semi with features that make it difficult to convert to FA, and thus challenge the ATF’s ruling as improper as applied.  </p>
<p>(Why anyone would actually WANT an open-bolt semi is another question.)</p>
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		<title>
		By: LKB		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4661</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[LKB]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jun 2024 11:52:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4661</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4622&quot;&gt;Geoff &quot;I&#039;m getting too old for this shit&quot; PR&lt;/a&gt;.

I’ve sent Dan my draft of a longer piece; hopefully it will be up soon.

To answer your instant question, where a regulation has been challenged in the past, but was judicially upheld under Chevron deference, Roberts’ opinion says those court decisions still stand under the principle of stare decisis.   It’s not unusual for SCOTUS to say “this is the new rule going forward,” and indeed giving a decision retroactive effect is disfavored and usually reserved only for cases involving fundamental constitutional rights.  

What the death of Chevron means that any new regs, or old ones that nobody challenged in court because Chevron meant doing so would have been a fool’s errand, are now fair game.   And goofiness like the proposed gas stove bans or efforts to regulate CO2 emissions under the Clean Air Act are going to face very tough sledding, as test cases will be forum shopped into districts where they’ll get killed (remember, the remedy when you challenge a regulation is to have the court order it vacated — thus if one challenger wins, we all do).

Again, it is hard to fully emphasize just how big a deal the 1-2 punch of Jarkesy + Loper Bright is.   Biden stinking up the joint Thursday night has sucked all the air from the room, but the media is starting to get the message (from the bureaucrats) about exactly what this means . . . and they are shrieking!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4622">Geoff &#8220;I&#8217;m getting too old for this shit&#8221; PR</a>.</p>
<p>I’ve sent Dan my draft of a longer piece; hopefully it will be up soon.</p>
<p>To answer your instant question, where a regulation has been challenged in the past, but was judicially upheld under Chevron deference, Roberts’ opinion says those court decisions still stand under the principle of stare decisis.   It’s not unusual for SCOTUS to say “this is the new rule going forward,” and indeed giving a decision retroactive effect is disfavored and usually reserved only for cases involving fundamental constitutional rights.  </p>
<p>What the death of Chevron means that any new regs, or old ones that nobody challenged in court because Chevron meant doing so would have been a fool’s errand, are now fair game.   And goofiness like the proposed gas stove bans or efforts to regulate CO2 emissions under the Clean Air Act are going to face very tough sledding, as test cases will be forum shopped into districts where they’ll get killed (remember, the remedy when you challenge a regulation is to have the court order it vacated — thus if one challenger wins, we all do).</p>
<p>Again, it is hard to fully emphasize just how big a deal the 1-2 punch of Jarkesy + Loper Bright is.   Biden stinking up the joint Thursday night has sucked all the air from the room, but the media is starting to get the message (from the bureaucrats) about exactly what this means . . . and they are shrieking!</p>
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		<title>
		By: White Women		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4659</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[White Women]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jun 2024 09:51:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4659</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4612&quot;&gt;Dude&lt;/a&gt;.

Sure he&#039;s a liar, drunk, womanizer, abuser and a thief but he&#039;s also a Kennedy. :swoon:]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4612">Dude</a>.</p>
<p>Sure he&#8217;s a liar, drunk, womanizer, abuser and a thief but he&#8217;s also a Kennedy. :swoon:</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dude		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4635</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dude]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jun 2024 01:36:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4635</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4613&quot;&gt;Dude&lt;/a&gt;.

Strong voter ID laws make it more difficult to cheat. I don&#039;t know, but I doubt Texas tries to mail out ballots to everyone like some other states have started doing.

That leaves some Hispanic counties legitimately flipping red very recently, as in only four years ago. The way I understand it, your logic is that if those particular Hispanic people have flipped their votes, then the incoming illegal immigrants will also vote Republican when they are able to. 

Here&#039;s why that&#039;s not how it works: We can look at how other Hispanics were voting in 2020. The ones who weren&#039;t directly impacted by illegal immigration continued to vote for Democrats. Now, in 2024, we have even more probably voting R, maybe even a majority. Why? Their life experiences have changed. Illegal immigration is so crazy right now, that every state is a border state. (I have a theory for another reason. I think the spell Dems have had Hispanics and blacks under is faltering, like you mentioned above. I think they realized Orange Hitler wasn&#039;t the racist they were told he was, etc.)

In other words, despite looking and sounding similar, they had very different life experiences (until it became more similar under the Puppet Admin). Likewise, second and third generation Hispanic American citizens have very different life experiences compared to the incoming illegals.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4613">Dude</a>.</p>
<p>Strong voter ID laws make it more difficult to cheat. I don&#8217;t know, but I doubt Texas tries to mail out ballots to everyone like some other states have started doing.</p>
<p>That leaves some Hispanic counties legitimately flipping red very recently, as in only four years ago. The way I understand it, your logic is that if those particular Hispanic people have flipped their votes, then the incoming illegal immigrants will also vote Republican when they are able to. </p>
<p>Here&#8217;s why that&#8217;s not how it works: We can look at how other Hispanics were voting in 2020. The ones who weren&#8217;t directly impacted by illegal immigration continued to vote for Democrats. Now, in 2024, we have even more probably voting R, maybe even a majority. Why? Their life experiences have changed. Illegal immigration is so crazy right now, that every state is a border state. (I have a theory for another reason. I think the spell Dems have had Hispanics and blacks under is faltering, like you mentioned above. I think they realized Orange Hitler wasn&#8217;t the racist they were told he was, etc.)</p>
<p>In other words, despite looking and sounding similar, they had very different life experiences (until it became more similar under the Puppet Admin). Likewise, second and third generation Hispanic American citizens have very different life experiences compared to the incoming illegals.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dude		</title>
		<link>https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4634</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dude]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Jun 2024 01:32:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/?p=8606#comment-4634</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4612&quot;&gt;Dude&lt;/a&gt;.

&quot;I’m convinced a big part of that is their constant screech of ‘Racist!’ beginning to bite them in the ass.&quot;

I think so. Some are realizing that was a lie designed to keep Dems in power.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://staging.shootingnewsweekly.com/atf/breaking-supreme-court-deals-chevron-deference-a-body-blow/comment-page-1/#comment-4612">Dude</a>.</p>
<p>&#8220;I’m convinced a big part of that is their constant screech of ‘Racist!’ beginning to bite them in the ass.&#8221;</p>
<p>I think so. Some are realizing that was a lie designed to keep Dems in power.</p>
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